JPHiP Forum
The PIEHOLE => H!P Crapola => Topic started by: sayumi_fan on February 01, 2015, 08:03:56 AM
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I have meant to raise this for weeks ever since the big round of end of year music shows, so it's not as topical as it could have been - but still on my mind.
Morning Musume had a 10 year run on the big NHK show Kohaku Uta Gassen from the late '90s to the late '00s (not sure of exact years, maybe 1998 to 2007?). I read that C-ute and Berryz have also appeared back then.
However, I don't think any of H!P has appeared since around 2007 or so... again, I could be slightly wrong, but overall they are not featured any more. Furthermore, they don't get a look into Music Station Super Live or other shows either. Only Countdown TV featured Momusu at the end of 2014 as far as I can see.
There is some reading about all this at these places:
https://kiokuchan.wordpress.com/2013/11/29/kohaku-and-morning-musume/ (https://kiokuchan.wordpress.com/2013/11/29/kohaku-and-morning-musume/)
http://www.intlwota.com/happydisco/?p=751 (http://www.intlwota.com/happydisco/?p=751) - Thoughts about 2013 Kohaku
http://www.hello-online.org/index.php?act=helloonline&CODE=article&topic=598 (http://www.hello-online.org/index.php?act=helloonline&CODE=article&topic=598) - First time in 10 years that Kohaku didn't feature Momusu (2008)
http://www.en.barks.jp/news/?id=1000002845 (http://www.en.barks.jp/news/?id=1000002845) - BARKS interview with Tsunku, in which he reveals that there were thoughts that the break-up of Momusu could be announced after their very first Kohaku appearance - thank goodness *that* didn't come true!
So my question is, what has happened that seems to make H!P groups so on the nose for the end of year music shows? Has Tsunku or Naoki Yamazaki or someone just totally annoyed the TV music show world somehow? Is there some feature of H!P that has made them less acceptable now?
There are artists who have appeared on Kohaku for 20, 30 or 40 years, so it's not that they are always looking for new acts. But if Momusu under Sayu's leadership could make Kohaku, I can't see they ever will. Actually, that was one of my biggest regrets for Sayu - that she didn't get to lead Momusu in a triumphal 2013 Kohaku comeback.
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The short answer to all your questions is that no one really knows what happened, if anything.
It's just not part of public knowledge and it's doubtful we will ever really know.
Morning Musume's situation reminds me of another notable case of a popular act getting the cold shoulder for years on end.
In 1978, Pink Lady at the height of their popularity tried to do their own new year's show, in competition with Kouhaku.
After that, they weren't invited back for the next 10 years.
Make no mistake, the people who run this show are far from impartial.
As you suggested, it could very well be that someone on the song selection committee is carrying such a grudge for UFP acts.
Alternatively, certain other popular idol groups could have threatened not to appear if our girls were invited.
I have no basis for this, but would anyone be surprised if this were the case?
Some acts appear every year for decades, despite not releasing anything new for years.
Meanwhile, Morning Musume gets #1s for 3 weeks out of the year and gets no recognition.
No one knows exactly how the song selection process goes, but it's clear to me that it isn't based on merit or sales figures.
For me, there's no such thing as "deserves to be invited" anymore--it's just lost all meaning.
Kouhaku hasn't given me a reason to watch for most of the last decade, and in fact has given me dozens of reasons NOT to watch.
At this point, my opinion of the show has gotten so low that I'm not even sure I'd be all that happy if Morning Musume was re-invited.
Honestly, I see Kouhaku as a corrupt circle-jerk that isn't worth getting worked up about.
Your questions are interesting ones for discussion, but I just don't care that much anymore.
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The short answer to all your questions is that no one really knows what happened, if anything.
It's just not part of public knowledge and it's doubtful we will ever really know.
Morning Musume's situation reminds me of another notable case of a popular act getting the cold shoulder for years on end.
In 1978, Pink Lady at the height of their popularity tried to do their own new year's show, in competition with Kouhaku.
After that, they weren't invited back for the next 10 years.
Make no mistake, the people who run this show are far from impartial.
As you suggested, it could very well be that someone on the song selection committee is carrying such a grudge for UFP acts.
Alternatively, certain other popular idol groups could have threatened not to appear if our girls were invited.
I have no basis for this, but would anyone be surprised if this were the case?
Some acts appear every year for decades, despite not releasing anything new for years.
Meanwhile, Morning Musume gets #1s for 3 weeks out of the year and gets no recognition.
No one knows exactly how the song selection process goes, but it's clear to me that it isn't based on merit or sales figures.
For me, there's no such thing as "deserves to be invited" anymore--it's just lost all meaning.
Kouhaku hasn't given me a reason to watch for most of the last decade, and in fact has given me dozens of reasons NOT to watch.
At this point, my opinion of the show has gotten so low that I'm not even sure I'd be all that happy if Morning Musume was re-invited.
Honestly, I see Kouhaku as a corrupt circle-jerk that isn't worth getting worked up about.
Your questions are interesting ones for discussion, but I just don't care that much anymore.
The tendency is to really agree to this because this past one was pretty horrible with some sprinkle of okay acts but the issue is pretty much that the background to everything is that we don't really know what's going on and the questions very from all different places but in the end, sometimes not being there is the best thing for everyone.
Going to a party not being wanted is great enough to say "I'm not being wanted" and you can find another thing to do instead with that tme to have more fun than what you would have had at the party.
I watch kouhaku to just watch it and end up disappointed anyways :nervous
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Some acts appear every year for decades, despite not releasing anything new for years.
Does end of year music shows like Kohaku even matter anymore? Momusu under Sayu's leadership made Broadway, NY; like she'll give a fuck about missing Kohaku
Let's look at another group who hasn't gotten Kohaku invites: Babymetal but guess where they've been? Canada. Germany. USA. London. And their latest song is a collab with DRAGONFORCE.
Sure 3letters48 & JE acts like SMAP are Kohaku regulars; but when was their last tour of Europe or North America?
The audience's cheers heard at every Kohaku pales in comparison to what Momusu gets every time they're in Taipei Ariport, or what Berryz get in Thailand anyways
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I enjoy Kohaku, and I was hoping Morning Musume would have been on
The show this past year, but sadly it did not happen.
Kohaku has its detractors for sure, but acts that are invited to appear still consider it an honor.
The theory that one pop group threatened not to appear if another group was invited seems very far fetched to me...
If I were to go out on a limb, I would say there could be a feud between NHK Kohaku management and the management of the group not invited, which could have sprung from some previous contractual disagreement.
Anyway behind the scenes of the entertainment world can be pretty vicious.
The fans who attended the New York concert certainly gave Morning Musume an
amazing reception, and I think the girls will have some great lifetime memories of that experience
and interaction with the fans. The reception given Kanon Suzuki was especially touching, and was brought up
on more than one variety and news show in Japan.
"Ask not what your favorite J-Pop Group
can do for you, but what you can do
for your favorite J-Pop Group"
(http://picroda.jphip.com/hp/jphip34828.jpg)
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Hello! Project does their own lengthy end of the year countdown show(s) now where every group and many guests get to perform.
I much prefer that to a 'blink-and-you'll-miss-it' appearance on Kohaku.
As an aside: MM'14 indeed was on last year's CDTV LIVE end of the year show, which they haven't been on in a long while.
Your questions are interesting ones for discussion, but I just don't care that much anymore.
Pretty much this.
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Great discussion, folks, and some interesting points which make me feel a whole lot better about Momusu and H!P not being on Kohaku etc. (And yes, TommyVD, I did mention that they made it onto CDTV, which was surprising, glad you saw that too!)
Point very well made that Sayu took Momusu to NYC, and Babymetal went there too... so not such a big deal for them being snubbed by certain interests in Japan.
I do enjoy all those end of year shows, but I do get a bit tired of of seeing the same acts repeated over and over. In that way, I did feel that CDTV was a breath of fresh air at times, and not only because they included Momusu.
Very interesting about Pink Lady from so long ago, btw!
Anyway, great discussion folks - thanks for all the input!!
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Honestly, I see Kouhaku as a corrupt circle-jerk that isn't worth getting worked up about.
Basically, it's just like the Oscars! :lol:
I mean, I enjoyed this thread, GJ guyse.
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Adding to the discussion...
The potential of anyone to break away and compete directly with Kouhaku is still part of the program but enough competition can draw away viewers although I would assume that the demographics could also be in play because the young people would usually be out and having fun rather than be at home to watch it (Assumption :nervous)
It could be just a young people's game if anything to get the viewers but just throwing it out there for argument's sake :nervous
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OK I'll just say it: some NHK exec's pockets weren't sufficiently filled with legal tender paper stuffs.
But, man, what a run that was. I will NEVER forget "Love Machine" opening the show in 1999.
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^ Yesh!!!
(http://picroda.jphip.com/hp/jphip34866.jpg)
(第50回NHK紅白歌合戦 1999.12.31)モーニング娘。-LOVEマシーン —在线播放—优酷网，视频高清在线观看 (http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMzQ4NTg5OTA0)